2 sec rule..etc

My comments on the 2012 mission was by error was posted as 2011 FNG story. If anyone would like to comment please do so under the general forum.

Unfortunatly this event is not for everyone. Sorry you had less then a great ride with us. The 2 second rule is not just the RFTW thing. It is also what the Motorcycle Safety Ffoundationi recommends to all riders in group situations. On the RFTW you need to be far more vigilant then other rides and understand that, to call attention to our mission, we must do things that make riders uncomfortable. We have ridden this way for 24 years and if you look at our safety record it is pretty damn good. There has never been a fatality on the run and this years accident on the CR was the first of its kind in the RFTW history. And this accident was totally the fault of the riders involved. Not the way the RFTW rides. Most accidents on motorcycles are caused by the rider not paying attention to what they need to do. And on the RFTW it is far more important then anywhere else. We see a lot of riders with their feet out on the highway pegs listening to music and just having a gay old time. The fact is that we are on a mission and if I had my druthers I would not ride this event either. I do not like group riding and do not trust very many other riders with my and my wifes safety. But until our mission is accomplished I will ride with my brothers and sisters any way we need to get it done. I have done the run 4 times and will return for my 5th as long as I am able. And as many more as I will be able to do. It is about the mission, not about you or me.

NICKEL DEUCE WROTE: "As a FNG on the SR this year I and a friend of mine (also a FNG) found the 2 sec rule in formation as very unsafe and dangerous. In addition, riders that pulled next to you even when in a stagered platoon is not only a major distraction but nerve racking. I was told (name with held) that for a FNG it is a white nuckel experience. My opinion, all of the above should be changed. I was in platoon 8 and my friend in platoon 4 and we both had the same issue. In my case, I hit the trike in front of me due to a sudden stop event, thank GOD another trike as was not next to me. I told one of the platoon official that I did not take this mission to wreck my trike or anyone other trike. I do not think you can ever eliminate the rubber band effect with so many bikes by a signal to "close it up" only to be followed by a sudden stop. This is what happened to me which caused damage to my trike. As it stands now my friend is a hell no for next year or any year. As for me, I'm leaning in that direction. I wonder how many FNG'S don't return for similair reasons."

 

 

I'd like to expand a bit on Curly's comments, and those of some others, if I may.  Our Mission Statement says not one word about riding motorcycles, yet that's what we do.  It's implied... it's a given that goes without being said.  Our motto says, "WE RIDE FOR THOSE WHO CAN'T."  Implicit in that statement is the promise that we will represent those who can't ride for themselves with dignity, honor, and a certain degree of professionalism in our riding.  This is NOT a HOG chapter ride, a poker run, or a sight-seeing tour.  We're on a mission... it's a serious run for a serious purpose.

 

 

Now, there are those who argue that our riding style is dangerous.  To that, I repeat: Riding in Run For The Wall is not inherently dangerous, but it is mercilessly unforgiving of any error, incapacity or neglect.  Every rider has to keep his head in the game every second of every minute of every hour while this run is on the road.  Anything less and you're not holding up your end of the bargain.  "It's a mission, not a party," and it's hard work.  If you're here to have fun, you picked the wrong run.  There's plenty of fun to be had, but it's found in our stops and at our destination.  While riding, if you get to the next stop and you recall any scenery other than the license plate of the bike in front of you, you screwed up.

 

 

To those who complain that the mission isn't worth compromising safety, I say this... safety should always be one of the foremost considerations in any decisions affecting the way we ride, but if safety were the only concern, we'd all just mail in our good wishes and stay in bed.  This run, like so many other things in life, requires some trade-offs.  There's risk in anything we do.  The trick is managing that risk, and RFTW has done a magnificent job of that for 24 years, this year's accident notwithstanding.  This accident had nothing to do with riding style or riding at close intervals; it had everything to do with a couple of riders trying to push a bad position and boxing themselves in with no way out.  This despite daily cautions by the route leadership to always yield to the other vehicles on the road and to re-establish the platoon integrity later.

 

As for complaints about the "2 Second Rule," it's mostly a myth, anyway.  A real, full two seconds goes like this: O-n-e O-n-e-t-h-o-u-s-a-n-d, T-w-o O-n-e-t-h-o-u-s-a-n-d.  At 60 mph, it results in an interval of half a football field, end zones included.  Seriously... do the math.  An RFTW "2 seconds" is more like "thousandonethousandtwo."  In other words, real fast and real close.  The ONLY way to ride this close in comfort and safety is to master precise throttle control, and everybody has to be there operating as one.  If you aren't yet this proficient, again, this run is NOT for you!   

 

As a final thought, consider the people on the overpasses.  We're going to ride under that overpass whether they're there, or not.  They came out to see us, not the other way around.  But when we do pass beneath them, they deserve to see a well disciplined group of accomplished, dedicated riders, not a rag-tag bunch of weekend wannabes.  We owe that to them.  And we owe that to "those who can't ride for themselves."  That's why we ride the way we do.  Nothing less is acceptable.  If this kind of riding isn't for you, then take a place on one of those overpasses.

Edited by PapaSmurf - Jun-10-2012 at 12:24pm

I have heard complaints about running into the back of other motorcycles being the fault of the ride formation. From all I know about the law and about riding and driving in general, it is always the fault of the person who runs into someone when these events occur. And usually it is because lack of paying attention was involved. If I were to rear end someone, I would take responsibility for my actions and admit that I screwed up. Not that the person in front of me stopped to quickly. We are all responsible for our own ride and if someone is urging me to do something I know to be unsafe for me, I have the right to refuse. The only tme I ride closer then 2 seconds from the bike in front of me is when I am riding with responsible riders I know and trust. Otherwise I maintain a distance I know is right for me. I ride within what I know to be my ability level. As all riders should do. Of course some are not realistic about their abilities. As a rider of many years I still take an ERC course every other year just to make sure I am still up to par. If the way things are done on the RFTW are not what is comfortable for you, there are other choices. If you still wish to be a part of our noble mission, ride in front of or in back of the pack. Or volunteer for a chase vehicle or some orf the other positions that do not ride with the pack. But please do not assume it is ok to try and change the way things have been succsessfully and safely for 24 years. I guess I have more then 2 cents worth to give so there you have some more of my spare change.

Nickel Duce,

Curly wrote: Of course there have been incidents on both routes. But to catastrphize is a bit over the top. I respect your opinions and views but the only way it could be done better and safer would be to not do it at all. There will always be accidents as long as we allow just anyone to enter our ranks. It seems trying to get everyone to prove their abilities are adequate is not obtainable. I think everyone should have at least an ERC course under their belt. But in my experience with those courses they pass you even if you can not do all of the exercises. I took a course a couple of years ago that had 8 guys in it. 6 of them could not do half of them and they still got their certificate. So that is bogus at best unles the rider himself admits his downfalls and takes some follow up courses to improve. A couple of friends and i set up cones and invite members of our HOG chapter to attend. We get maybe 2 or three riders that are willing to admit they need help. All of the others are to afraid to show anyone that they are lacking in the basic skills to ride well. All of this said I still think the run is as safe an atmosphere as can be expected and still be effective in delivering our message.   Sorry if I have in any way offended you ar anyone but the RFTW is very near and dear to my heart for reasons I will not go in to. When it feels to me like the run is being attacked I get a bit defensive.

Curly no offense taken and I will offer up the same apology if I offended.  One of the great freedoms we have in our Country is the freedom of speech.  We both served to protect that freedom along with the many more we enjoy.  I respect your opinion and tend to enjoy a good debate.  I hope to see you on the run and despite our difference of opinions we are all are after here to support our mission statement.   

Curly wrote: ...I took a course a couple of years ago that had 8 guys in it. 6 of them could not do half of them and they still got their certificate. So that is bogus at best unles the rider himself admits his downfalls and takes some follow up courses to improve. A couple of friends and i set up cones and invite members of our HOG chapter to attend. We get maybe 2 or three riders that are willing to admit they need help. All of the others are to afraid to show anyone that they are lacking in the basic skills to ride well. All of this said I still think the run is as safe an atmosphere as can be expected and still be effective in delivering our message.

Maybe their fear is the result of the atmosphere you and the others have created.  You readily admit that only 2 or 3 riders out of the entire chapter show up...generally not a good sign.

Maybe you'd get a better turnout if someone else led the impromptu training sessions.

But it just could be those others think setting up a few practice cones is bogus as well.

Sorry but we rode the CR ATW but in front of the pack so that we could welcome them into each stop as well as for the fact 2 riders were FNGs and did not feel good in the pack. We fueled on our own at each stop but we ate lunch and dinner with the Family and never had a problem except one time no one knew where they wanted us to park our bikes but that was soon taken care of and it worked out great. You can check out my pictures on my facebook page, James Bowen. I hope anyone who wants to see them can find them. One other thing I would like to say is each of these posts that say this ride is not for everyone is true to a point. There is always a way to do this other than on a bike as was posted already. Anyway what was important was we had a great mission we all got there. I really love this RFTW Family and what they do. By the way nobody does it better. God Bless you all.

Since my original post I find the comments / suggestions helpful but at times offensive. As a disabled Vietnam veteran completing the mission was very important to me. It is clear that some feel don't mess with RFTW because if it's not broken don't fix it. Trust me, I'm not saying its broken but maybe some review might be helpful. To always point the finger at the rider is not being open minded. In my case, at the time we left Rancho no one suggested I should consider riding up front or back, oh I forgot it's the riders responsibly. I'm not new to riding but was new to RFTW. I make no excuse for my disability or riding ability during RFTW so maybe RFTW should strongly encourage people like me and others to not participate in a event that can and will place them in harms way.

Nickel Deuce wrote: Since my original post...

Below is a copy of your original post.  I've taken the liberty of highlighting a passage in that post.

Nickel Deuce wrote: As a FNG on the SR this year I and a friend of mine (also a FNG) found the 2 sec rule in formation as very unsafe and dangerous. In addition, riders that pulled next to you even when in a stagered platoon is not only a major distraction but nerve racking. I was told (name with held) that for a FNG it is a white nuckel experience. My opinion, all of the above should be changed. I was in platoon 8 and my friend in platoon 4 and we both had the same issue. In my case, I hit the trike in front of me due to a sudden stop event, thank GOD another trike as was not next to me. I told one of the platoon official that I did not take this mission to wreck my trike or anyone other trike. I do not think you can ever eliminate the rubber band effect with so many bikes by a signal to "close it up" only to be followed by a sudden stop. This is what happened to me which caused damage to my trike. As it stands now my friend is a hell no for next year or any year. As for me, I'm leaning in that direction. I wonder how many FNG'S don't return for similair reasons.

I bring attention to this part and say I think it's unfortunate that your friend and possible you had a rather bad experience.

More unfortunate is that your story is not so unique.

Like you, I'm a disabled Vietnam vet, was an FNG on the SR (several years ago), and did not have a very good first mission.  Subsequent rides were not without safety-related problems either.

While I continue to support the RFTW, I don't ride with the group any longer.  My support is more in line with what "Papa Smurf" suggested...I just mail in my good wishes.

I'm concerned that in the not-too-distant future, the good press the RFTW now enjoys will be tarnished by reports of crashes, injuries, and even deaths occurring during a run because of what the non-riding public will perceive as dangerous riding.